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Reply #120 posted 04/08/20 4:39pm

DiminutiveRock
er

avatar

benni said:

Donald Trump Has Stake In Hydroxychloroquine Drugmaker: Report

Trump “has a small personal financial interest” in Sanofi, the French drugmaker that makes Plaquenil, the brand-name version of hydroxychloroquine, The New York Times reported Monday.

Some associates of Mr. Trump’s have financial interests in the issue. Sanofi’s largest shareholders include Fisher Asset Management, the investment company run by Ken Fisher, a major donor to Republicans, including Mr. Trump. A spokesman for Mr. Fisher declined to comment.

Another investor in both Sanofi and Mylan, another pharmaceutical firm, is Invesco, the fund previously run by Wilbur Ross, the commerce secretary. Mr. Ross said in a statement Monday that he “was not aware that Invesco has any investments in companies producing” the drug, “nor do I have any involvement in the decision to explore this as a treatment.”

As of last year, Mr. Trump reported that his three family trusts each had investments in a Dodge & Cox mutual fund, whose largest holding was in Sanofi.

Ashleigh Koss, a Sanofi spokeswoman, said the company no longer sells or distributes Plaquenil in the United States, although it does sell it internationally.

Several generic drugmakers are gearing up to produce hydroxychloroquine pills, including Amneal Pharmaceuticals, whose co-founder Chirag Patel is a member of Trump National Golf Course Bedminster in New Jersey and has golfed with Mr. Trump at least twice since he became president, according to a person who saw them.

Mr. Patel, whose company is based in Bridgewater, N.J., did not respond to a request for comment. Amneal announced last month that it would increase production of the drug and donate millions of pills to New York and other states. Other generic drugmakers are ramping up production, including Mylan and Teva Pharmaceutical Industries.

Roberto Mignone, a Teva board member, reached out to the team of Jared Kushner, the president’s son-in-law and senior adviser, through Nitin Saigal, who used to work for Mr. Mignone and is a friend of Mr. Kushner’s, according to people informed about the discussions.

Mr. Kushner’s team referred him to the White House task force and Mr. Mignone asked for help getting India to ease export restrictions, which have since been relaxed, allowing Teva to bring more pills into the United States. Mr. Mignone, who is also a vice chairman of NYU Langone Health, which is running a clinical study of hydroxychloroquine, confirmed on Monday that he has spoken with the administration about getting more medicine into the country.



Well, well, well.

[Edited 4/8/20 16:37pm]



eek and yet, not surprised at all.

Misinformation Kills
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Reply #121 posted 04/08/20 5:13pm

djThunderfunk

avatar

benni said:

Donald Trump Has Stake In Hydroxychloroquine Drugmaker: Report

Trump “has a small personal financial interest” in Sanofi, the French drugmaker that makes Plaquenil, the brand-name version of hydroxychloroquine, The New York Times reported Monday.

Some associates of Mr. Trump’s have financial interests in the issue. Sanofi’s largest shareholders include Fisher Asset Management, the investment company run by Ken Fisher, a major donor to Republicans, including Mr. Trump. A spokesman for Mr. Fisher declined to comment.

Another investor in both Sanofi and Mylan, another pharmaceutical firm, is Invesco, the fund previously run by Wilbur Ross, the commerce secretary. Mr. Ross said in a statement Monday that he “was not aware that Invesco has any investments in companies producing” the drug, “nor do I have any involvement in the decision to explore this as a treatment.”

As of last year, Mr. Trump reported that his three family trusts each had investments in a Dodge & Cox mutual fund, whose largest holding was in Sanofi.

Ashleigh Koss, a Sanofi spokeswoman, said the company no longer sells or distributes Plaquenil in the United States, although it does sell it internationally.

Several generic drugmakers are gearing up to produce hydroxychloroquine pills, including Amneal Pharmaceuticals, whose co-founder Chirag Patel is a member of Trump National Golf Course Bedminster in New Jersey and has golfed with Mr. Trump at least twice since he became president, according to a person who saw them.

Mr. Patel, whose company is based in Bridgewater, N.J., did not respond to a request for comment. Amneal announced last month that it would increase production of the drug and donate millions of pills to New York and other states. Other generic drugmakers are ramping up production, including Mylan and Teva Pharmaceutical Industries.

Roberto Mignone, a Teva board member, reached out to the team of Jared Kushner, the president’s son-in-law and senior adviser, through Nitin Saigal, who used to work for Mr. Mignone and is a friend of Mr. Kushner’s, according to people informed about the discussions.

Mr. Kushner’s team referred him to the White House task force and Mr. Mignone asked for help getting India to ease export restrictions, which have since been relaxed, allowing Teva to bring more pills into the United States. Mr. Mignone, who is also a vice chairman of NYU Langone Health, which is running a clinical study of hydroxychloroquine, confirmed on Monday that he has spoken with the administration about getting more medicine into the country.



Well, well, well.

[Edited 4/8/20 16:37pm]


Come on, benni. Even some liberal outlets are admitting that this small holding in this trust amounts to a big nothing burger. I shared the vox link above. If this was a real scandal they would jump on it, and even they are saying it's really not.

Read up on it. This is just silly.

djThunderfunk said:
Not because of some silly milano on the org.

PennyPurple thought it was racial slur and said:
Ban! Ban! Ban! Ban! Ban! lol
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Reply #122 posted 04/08/20 5:14pm

djThunderfunk

avatar

DiminutiveRocker said:

djThunderfunk said:


Yeah, I'd let my physician decide too, and if she didn't mention it, I'd ask about it.

There will not be a vaccine "soon". Fauci is saying 12-18 months and other experts are saying 18 months is "ridulously optimistic"

https://www.cnn.com/2020/...index.html


We're not staying home until then. Sorry, that's not a realistic option.


Mmkay, you do you. I am staying home until my local government says we can start getting back to being out, little by little. My company has already let us know that the end of June will be the earliest we could stop WFH, but also cautioned it could go to Sept.


Wait and see how your state/cities/towns handle it. shrug


The end of June is at least a year before we have a vaccine.

djThunderfunk said:
Not because of some silly milano on the org.

PennyPurple thought it was racial slur and said:
Ban! Ban! Ban! Ban! Ban! lol
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Reply #123 posted 04/08/20 5:19pm

purplethunder3
121

avatar

djThunderfunk said:

DiminutiveRocker said:

If, God forbid, I get it - I'll let my knowledgable physicians decide what treatment (maybe hydroxychloroquine, maybe not) will be best for me. As an intelligent person, I will not pretend to be a doctor and dictate my treatment. Cuz guess what? Watching YouTube and reading articles here and there does not mean jack shit if I do not have an M.D. The Trump Clown (borrow your endearing nickname) does not have an M.D.

pray an official antidote and vaccine be avaiolable soon. Until then... STAY HOME - IT'S WORKING (unless you have an ignorant local government, in that case - god speed)


Yeah, I'd let my physician decide too, and if she didn't mention it, I'd ask about it.

There will not be a vaccine "soon". Fauci is saying 12-18 months and other experts are saying 18 months is "ridulously optimistic"

https://www.cnn.com/2020/...index.html


We're not staying home until then. Sorry, that's not a realistic option.


In 12-18 mos., if this keeps up, thousands of people won't have homes to stay in place in... neutral

"Music gives a soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination and life to everything." --Plato
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Reply #124 posted 04/08/20 6:14pm

IanRG

djThunderfunk said:

"Damn I'm glad y'all set it off!" lol

If you really think that the trust Trump has an investment in is going to make him any money that he would notice, then you clearly haven't taken the time to read the details of this tiny holding in a mutual fund, or, you just don't understand it.

Here, even Vox, who aren't saying good things about hydroxychloroquine, at least are able to explain that Trump isn't going to make any significant money off this:

Trump’s promotion of unproven drugs is cause for alarm, but not because he’s making money off it

https://www.vox.com/2020/...anofi-owns


So yeah, to say Trump mentioned it to make money is fake news.

The fact is this treatment has been very promising. Here's a doctor in L.A. sharing his success using the drug for his patients.

"Every patient I've prescribed it to has been very, very ill and within 8 to 12 hours, they were basically symptom-free," Cardillo told Eyewitness News. "So clinically I am seeing a resolution."

Cardillo is the CEO of Mend Urgent Care, which has locations in Sherman Oaks, Van Nuys and Burbank.

He said he has found it only works if combined with zinc. The drug, he said, opens a channel for the zinc to enter the cell and block virus replication.

He added that the drug should not be prescribed for those who are presenting only mild symptoms, as there are concerns about shortages for patients with other conditions who need to take the drug on a regular basis.


https://abc7.com/health/l...9/6079864/



Of course it needs more study. But so far, the results have been positive. Either way, it's going to be a loooooong time before there is a vaccine, and guess what? Even that won't be 100% guaranteed. In fact, if the virus keeps mutating, the vaccine will be out of date by the time it's available.

So, tell ya what. If God forbid I catch the virus, I'll ask my doctor to try this treatment, and if God forbid any of you get the virus, you can tell your doctor that you don't want Trump to make any money, much less be right about something, so you don't want it.

Finally, I know none of you will watch this, but just in case there are some rational lurkers out there that just don't post because of the hostility, here's something to watch while stuck at home:

https://www.youtube.com/w...6&t=0s




[Edited 4/8/20 13:52pm]

.

Or as Dr Fauci said: It works for some and not for others. What trump said was wrong when he said take it, it cannot do any harm.

.

Dr Cardillo (note the two letters in front of both Fauci and Cardillo and not in front of trump's) discouraged general use. He is passing on his experiences to medical professionals, just like so many other doctors worldwide. Some will be reporting on the successful use of this in combination with other therapies whilst others are reporting little or no benefit together with adverse side effects including seizures that stopped a real trial in Switzerland. A balanced, informed analysis must be made by professionals, not a partisan trump was right forum argument.

.

You know what Doctors really like? It is uneducated patients saying they heard about such and such a drug and they want their doctor to prescribe this instead of what the doctor with all their education and experience and connections to actual pharmaceutical research and shared professional knowledge, are prescribing to meet that patient's particular circumstances. If you keep to Dr Cardillo's advice on when it should be prescribed and you are unfortunate enough to catch this, then, fortunately for your doctor, you will be too sick to provide your doctor with your partisan "professional" advice.

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Reply #125 posted 04/08/20 6:26pm

djThunderfunk

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Fortunately for all of us, most doctors don't care about the bullshit going on in the media or politics, and if any of us are sick enough, they will probably try it, since so far, it seems to be effective. wink

djThunderfunk said:
Not because of some silly milano on the org.

PennyPurple thought it was racial slur and said:
Ban! Ban! Ban! Ban! Ban! lol
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Reply #126 posted 04/08/20 6:39pm

IanRG

djThunderfunk said:

Fortunately for all of us, most doctors don't care about the bullshit going on in the media or politics, and if any of us are sick enough, they will probably try it, since so far, it seems to be effective. wink

.

Exactly, they will continue to ignore trump and trump's fans and deal with the situation as best they can with what looks least ineffective with appropriate consideration of side effects until whatever new or improved therapies or combinations of therapies are properly and verifiably found to be better. It may be Chloroquine with zinc or a development from this to handle the issues or something completely different. Whichever it is will have nothing at all to do with the bullshit from trump and the trumpclones.

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Reply #127 posted 04/08/20 7:33pm

djThunderfunk

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Nobody said it was because of Trump, ya genius. it was because of doctors in China and Europe trying it and having success with it, the U.S. media reporting on that, and Trump commenting on the reports. Sheesh, you're single minded.

djThunderfunk said:
Not because of some silly milano on the org.

PennyPurple thought it was racial slur and said:
Ban! Ban! Ban! Ban! Ban! lol
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Reply #128 posted 04/08/20 7:48pm

djThunderfunk

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Oh, wow! Look at this. Even SNOPES is calling out this bullshit about Trump profitting from this?!

MOSTLY FALSE

What's True

U.S. President Donald Trump earns some income from three family trusts that are administered independently by J.P. Morgan, an investment bank and wealth-management firm. These trusts are in part invested in mutual funds that themselves are partially invested in companies that produce hydroxychloroquine.

What's False

Trump’s financial stake in these companies is virtually negligible — contained indirectly via mutual funds — and administered through three family trusts he does not control. As a generic drug, hydroxychloroquine is unlikely to provide any one company with significant profits compared to other proprietary drugs.


https://www.snopes.com/fa...loroquine/


So sorry, jj, benni and the rest... It is indeed FAKE NEWS! lol lol lol

To be clear, yes there's an investment, no it has nothing to do with him promoting these drugs.

Vox, Snopes, these are not Trump "fans". They don't even give him the clown status that I do.
They despise him. Just like all of you.

That's cool. We've all jumped to share stories in the media only to have them immediately debunked.

Don't feel bad. comfort

djThunderfunk said:
Not because of some silly milano on the org.

PennyPurple thought it was racial slur and said:
Ban! Ban! Ban! Ban! Ban! lol
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Reply #129 posted 04/08/20 8:23pm

IanRG

djThunderfunk said:

Oh, wow! Look at this. Even SNOPES is calling out this bullshit about Trump profitting from this?!

MOSTLY FALSE

What's True

U.S. President Donald Trump earns some income from three family trusts that are administered independently by J.P. Morgan, an investment bank and wealth-management firm. These trusts are in part invested in mutual funds that themselves are partially invested in companies that produce hydroxychloroquine.

What's False

Trump’s financial stake in these companies is virtually negligible — contained indirectly via mutual funds — and administered through three family trusts he does not control. As a generic drug, hydroxychloroquine is unlikely to provide any one company with significant profits compared to other proprietary drugs.


https://www.snopes.com/fa...loroquine/


So sorry, jj, benni and the rest... It is indeed FAKE NEWS! lol lol lol

To be clear, yes there's an investment, no it has nothing to do with him promoting these drugs.

Vox, Snopes, these are not Trump "fans". They don't even give him the clown status that I do.
They despise him. Just like all of you.

That's cool. We've all jumped to share stories in the media only to have them immediately debunked.

Don't feel bad. comfort

.

As one of the people who said nothing about this indirect investment, I am more concerned about the pseudoscience of comments made by trump and the trumpclones for purely partisan reasons.

.

I look forward to the medical professionals developing much better knowledge on therapy programs for people affected by Covid19 and an end to people like trump or who like trump pushing myths, miracles cures and half truths to hide his failure to manage this crisis.

.

How much time have you wasted looking to articles to support your man?

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Reply #130 posted 04/08/20 8:38pm

IanRG

IanRG said:

Exactly, they will continue to ignore trump and trump's fans and deal with the situation as best they can with what looks least ineffective with appropriate consideration of side effects until whatever new or improved therapies or combinations of therapies are properly and verifiably found to be better. It may be Chloroquine with zinc or a development from this to handle the issues or something completely different. Whichever it is will have nothing at all to do with the bullshit from trump and the trumpclones.

djThunderfunk said:

Nobody said it was because of Trump, ya genius. it was because of doctors in China and Europe trying it and having success with it, the U.S. media reporting on that, and Trump commenting on the reports. Sheesh, you're single minded.

.

I appreciate that my comment could be misinterpreted by people with TDS, especially pro-trump TDS.

.

My comment is not about trump - It is about how the doctors around the world who ARE sharing results and data and are ignoring trump and the trumpclones. It is for a sensible, science, fact and clinical trial based response to prove and improve the inadequate therapies currently available. This week two trials of Chloroquine were completed or cancelled showing no signifcant support for Chloroquine and a good reason to question whether it is a good solution.

.

We will be happier once we know if Chlorophine with something else has been proven and improved or anything else is found to be better. Outside of the partisan trumpclones, no one cares which therapy or therapies is ultimately found to be the best treatments.

[Edited 4/8/20 20:40pm]

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Reply #131 posted 04/09/20 5:35am

poppys

djThunderfunk said:

Nobody said it was because of Trump, ya genius. it was because of doctors in China and Europe trying it and having success with it, the U.S. media reporting on that, and Trump commenting on the reports. Sheesh, you're single minded.


You call Ian single minded, and yet the only thing you post in this thread is how we don't accept this "cure" because we don't like Trump. Broken record.

Hydroxychloroquine stumbles under lack of evidence

Debate rages over whether a decades-old antimalarial, hydroxychloroquine, offers genuine promise as a potential COVID-19 treatment. The World Health Organization has included the drug in its global trial, SOLIDARITY, but its efficacy is as yet unproven.

• Pharmaceutical researcher Derek Lowe explores evidence from small trials and

preprints that hydroxychloroquine is not effective against COVID-19. (Science Translational Medicine blog | 6 min read)

• Microbiologist Didier Raoult’s controversial research is the wellspring of some of the enthusiasm for the drug. The study has now received a statement of concern from the society that publishes the journal in which it appeared. (Retraction Watch | 3 min read)

• Attorney Olga Lucia Torres, who takes hydroxychloroquine to treat her lupus, describes her worries for people who rely on the drug. There have been some shortages as people snap up supplies in the wake of unsubstantiated recommendations from US President Donald Trump, prominent US media figures and Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro. (The New York Times | 5 min read)

https://www.nature.com/nature/articles?type=nature-briefing

[Edited 4/9/20 7:02am]

"if you can't clap on the one, then don't clap at all"
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Reply #132 posted 04/09/20 5:44am

benni

avatar

The journal that originally published an article regarding Chloroquine and Z Pak, have pulled it. This was the same research that Trump used to push it.


Publisher of hydroxychloroquine study touted by Trump says the research didn't meet its standards


https://us.cnn.com/2020/0...index.html


But now the medical society that published that French research has issued a statement saying the study "does not meet the Society's expected standard."

Dr. Kevin Tracey, president and CEO of the Feinstein Institutes for Medical Research in New York City, gave an even more pointed assessment of the French research. "The study was a complete failure," he said.

"It was pathetic," added Art Caplan, head of the division of medical ethics at the New York University School of Medicine.

The study started out with 26 patients taking the hydroxychloroquine, but six were "lost in follow up during the survey because of early cessation of treatment," according to the study.

Three left because they ended up in the intensive care unit, another patient died, and a fifth stopped treatment due to nausea. It turned out the sixth patient didn't actually have coronavirus.

Leaving out the five patients who took the drug and didn't fare well is "cherry picking," said Caplan, the bioethicist."That's not science," he said. "You've got your thumb on the scale.

"The remaining 20 patients took hydroxychloroquine, some with the antibiotic azithromycin and some without, and their outcomes were compared with patients who did not take either drug.

The study authors wrote that "100%" of patients who took the drug combination were "virologically cured" compared to 57.1% of the patients who took hydroxychloroquine alone and 12.5% of the control group. The authors did not fully explain what they meant by "virologically cured."

Caplan added that even without the "cherry picking" issue, a study with such a small number of patients is basically meaningless.

"It's just a jumbled mess," he said.

Several centers are doing clinical trials on hydroxychloroquine to prevent or treat coronavirus, including Harvard, Columbia, New York University and Henry Ford Health System in Detroit.

Tracey, the researcher at the Feinstein Institutes in New York City, is also conducting a study on the drug. He said despite the French study being "seriously flawed," it's still worth looking at hydroxychloroquine to see if it's safe and effective for a subset of coronavirus patients.
Trump: "It was hard to get it aroused and it is hard to get it aroused but we got it aroused."
[narrator voice] He's talking about the "American way."
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Reply #133 posted 04/09/20 5:54am

benni

avatar

djThunderfunk said:

benni said:

Donald Trump Has Stake In Hydroxychloroquine Drugmaker: Report

Trump “has a small personal financial interest” in Sanofi, the French drugmaker that makes Plaquenil, the brand-name version of hydroxychloroquine, The New York Times reported Monday.

Some associates of Mr. Trump’s have financial interests in the issue. Sanofi’s largest shareholders include Fisher Asset Management, the investment company run by Ken Fisher, a major donor to Republicans, including Mr. Trump. A spokesman for Mr. Fisher declined to comment.

Another investor in both Sanofi and Mylan, another pharmaceutical firm, is Invesco, the fund previously run by Wilbur Ross, the commerce secretary. Mr. Ross said in a statement Monday that he “was not aware that Invesco has any investments in companies producing” the drug, “nor do I have any involvement in the decision to explore this as a treatment.”

As of last year, Mr. Trump reported that his three family trusts each had investments in a Dodge & Cox mutual fund, whose largest holding was in Sanofi.

Ashleigh Koss, a Sanofi spokeswoman, said the company no longer sells or distributes Plaquenil in the United States, although it does sell it internationally.

Several generic drugmakers are gearing up to produce hydroxychloroquine pills, including Amneal Pharmaceuticals, whose co-founder Chirag Patel is a member of Trump National Golf Course Bedminster in New Jersey and has golfed with Mr. Trump at least twice since he became president, according to a person who saw them.

Mr. Patel, whose company is based in Bridgewater, N.J., did not respond to a request for comment. Amneal announced last month that it would increase production of the drug and donate millions of pills to New York and other states. Other generic drugmakers are ramping up production, including Mylan and Teva Pharmaceutical Industries.

Roberto Mignone, a Teva board member, reached out to the team of Jared Kushner, the president’s son-in-law and senior adviser, through Nitin Saigal, who used to work for Mr. Mignone and is a friend of Mr. Kushner’s, according to people informed about the discussions.

Mr. Kushner’s team referred him to the White House task force and Mr. Mignone asked for help getting India to ease export restrictions, which have since been relaxed, allowing Teva to bring more pills into the United States. Mr. Mignone, who is also a vice chairman of NYU Langone Health, which is running a clinical study of hydroxychloroquine, confirmed on Monday that he has spoken with the administration about getting more medicine into the country.



Well, well, well.

[Edited 4/8/20 16:37pm]


Come on, benni. Even some liberal outlets are admitting that this small holding in this trust amounts to a big nothing burger. I shared the vox link above. If this was a real scandal they would jump on it, and even they are saying it's really not.

Read up on it. This is just silly.



Did you not read the part where they wrote "small financial interest"? I've bolded it above for you. So you've explained Trump and are gloating, but you did not address any of the other individuals in the article that gains from this. No where did I say that Trump's financial involvement was large. My "well, well, well" were the people in Trump's orbit that stand to gain from it. Yes, Trump's amount may be small, but that doesn't mean he doesn't stand to gain in other ways. For instance, if the drug sells well, the Republican donor will make sure to be extra generous with those that Trump would like him to donate to. Chirag Patel will owe Trump ~ his whole Quid Pro Quo type of dealing with people, so that if he sees Patel has made a killing because he touted the drug, then Patel will have to do him a favor at some point. Etc and so forth. There are many ways to be invested in something, it doesn't have to be just financial earnings. Favors are a big part of Trump's way in which to do business, "I rub your back, you rub mine" seems to be his motto.

Trump: "It was hard to get it aroused and it is hard to get it aroused but we got it aroused."
[narrator voice] He's talking about the "American way."
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Reply #134 posted 04/09/20 6:07am

djThunderfunk

avatar

You guys are really stretching this aren't you?!? This thread started with blaming Trump for people who drink fishtank cleaner, rounded it's way to accusing Trump of profitting and now here we are. This is precious.

For the mensa geniuses that keep accusing me of being "obsessed" with this because of Trump...
Count how many times I said his name in my posts, then count yours. In fact, do that in any thread in the forum. Now who's obsessed? lol lol lol

djThunderfunk said:
Not because of some silly milano on the org.

PennyPurple thought it was racial slur and said:
Ban! Ban! Ban! Ban! Ban! lol
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Reply #135 posted 04/09/20 6:37am

IanRG

djThunderfunk said:

You guys are really stretching this aren't you?!? This thread started with blaming Trump for people who drink fishtank cleaner, rounded it's way to accusing Trump of profitting and now here we are. This is precious.

For the mensa geniuses that keep accusing me of being "obsessed" with this because of Trump...
Count how many times I said his name in my posts, then count yours. In fact, do that in any thread in the forum. Now who's obsessed? lol lol lol

.

If I was as obsessed with defending trump to the same degree that you are obsessed with defending trump, I would also seek to say trump's name as little as possible in regards to ill-informed statements made by trump. This is because I would be interested in distancing trump's name from trump's disasterous handling of this crisis and the deaths trump's failure has created. trump's re-election hopes for a trump second term as president are dependent on people not associating trump's failure to manage this outbreak as effectively as most other countries. This failure has occured under trump's watch and the buck stops with trump.

.

As I am not obsessed with your man, I am interested in the health and safety of people during this world-wide crisis. Stupid promotion of the drug by idiot and their obsessed followers has resulted in hoarding of the drug and potentially dangerous over use or reliance on the drug in the US and places like Nigeria. In the period before proven sets of therapies are developed (even before a vaccine), the focus needs to be on facts, proof and science and not on your partisan politics. As I said before, you would not even be posting on this but for your obsessive support of your man.

[Edited 4/9/20 6:39am]

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Reply #136 posted 04/09/20 7:03am

poppys

IanRG said:

djThunderfunk said:

You guys are really stretching this aren't you?!? This thread started with blaming Trump for people who drink fishtank cleaner, rounded it's way to accusing Trump of profitting and now here we are. This is precious.

For the mensa geniuses that keep accusing me of being "obsessed" with this because of Trump...
Count how many times I said his name in my posts, then count yours. In fact, do that in any thread in the forum. Now who's obsessed? lol lol lol

.

If I was as obsessed with defending trump to the same degree that you are obsessed with defending trump, I would also seek to say trump's name as little as possible in regards to ill-informed statements made by trump. This is because I would be interested in distancing trump's name from trump's disasterous handling of this crisis and the deaths trump's failure has created. trump's re-election hopes for a trump second term as president are dependent on people not associating trump's failure to manage this outbreak as effectively as most other countries. This failure has occured under trump's watch and the buck stops with trump.

.

As I am not obsessed with your man, I am interested in the health and safety of people during this world-wide crisis. Stupid promotion of the drug by idiot and their obsessed followers has resulted in hoarding of the drug and potentially dangerous over use or reliance on the drug in the US and places like Nigeria. In the period before proven sets of therapies are developed (even before a vaccine), the focus needs to be on facts, proof and science and not on your partisan politics. As I said before, you would not even be posting on this but for your obsessive support of your man.


nod

"if you can't clap on the one, then don't clap at all"
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Reply #137 posted 04/09/20 8:11am

DiminutiveRock
er

avatar

djThunderfunk said:

You guys are really stretching this aren't you?!? This thread started with blaming Trump for people who drink fishtank cleaner, rounded it's way to accusing Trump of profitting and now here we are. This is precious.

For the mensa geniuses that keep accusing me of being "obsessed" with this because of Trump...
Count how many times I said his name in my posts, then count yours. In fact, do that in any thread in the forum. Now who's obsessed? lol lol lol


You. shrug


Back to topic. Fauci said this morning they are testing for people who have been exposed or contracted Covid-19 and have either A) became ill and fully recovered or B) had the virus and did not ever have symptoms where possibly their natural antibodies prevented the virus from taking hold.

I am thinking this kind of study is what brings us closer to a vaccine or antidote.











[Edited 4/9/20 8:18am]

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Reply #138 posted 04/09/20 8:16am

2elijah

avatar

They need to just test everybody instead of telling people with mild symptoms to stay home and quarantine, and only go to the ER if symptoms worsen, yet often times when the symptoms worsen, it’s too late.
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Reply #139 posted 04/09/20 8:17am

DiminutiveRock
er

avatar

2elijah said:

They need to just test everybody instead of telling people with mild symptoms to stay home and quarantine, and only go to the ER if symptoms worsen, yet often times when the symptoms worsen, it’s too late.



YES! The testing was key from the very beginning! nod and it remains so.

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Reply #140 posted 04/09/20 8:19am

2elijah

avatar

benni said:

The journal that originally published an article regarding Chloroquine and Z Pak, have pulled it. This was the same research that Trump used to push it.



Publisher of hydroxychloroquine study touted by Trump says the research didn't meet its standards



https://us.cnn.com/2020/0...index.html


But now the medical society that published that French research has issued a statement saying the study "does not meet the Society's expected standard."


Dr. Kevin Tracey, president and CEO of the Feinstein Institutes for Medical Research in New York City, gave an even more pointed assessment of the French research. "The study was a complete failure," he said.

"It was pathetic," added Art Caplan, head of the division of medical ethics at the New York University School of Medicine.

The study started out with 26 patients taking the hydroxychloroquine, but six were "lost in follow up during the survey because of early cessation of treatment," according to the study.

Three left because they ended up in the intensive care unit, another patient died, and a fifth stopped treatment due to nausea. It turned out the sixth patient didn't actually have coronavirus.

Leaving out the five patients who took the drug and didn't fare well is "cherry picking," said Caplan, the bioethicist."That's not science," he said. "You've got your thumb on the scale.

"The remaining 20 patients took hydroxychloroquine, some with the antibiotic azithromycin and some without, and their outcomes were compared with patients who did not take either drug.

The study authors wrote that "100%" of patients who took the drug combination were "virologically cured" compared to 57.1% of the patients who took hydroxychloroquine alone and 12.5% of the control group. The authors did not fully explain what they meant by "virologically cured."

Caplan added that even without the "cherry picking" issue, a study with such a small number of patients is basically meaningless.

"It's just a jumbled mess," he said.

Several centers are doing clinical trials on hydroxychloroquine to prevent or treat coronavirus, including Harvard, Columbia, New York University and Henry Ford Health System in Detroit.

Tracey, the researcher at the Feinstein Institutes in New York City, is also conducting a study on the drug. He said despite the French study being "seriously flawed," it's still worth looking at hydroxychloroquine to see if it's safe and effective for a subset of coronavirus patients.


Let’s hope trump stops pushing the drug as the end all be all, and finally just let the real medical experts educate the public on it.
popcorn
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Reply #141 posted 04/09/20 8:28am

DiminutiveRock
er

avatar

2elijah said:

benni said:

The journal that originally published an article regarding Chloroquine and Z Pak, have pulled it. This was the same research that Trump used to push it.


Publisher of hydroxychloroquine study touted by Trump says the research didn't meet its standards


https://us.cnn.com/2020/0...index.html


But now the medical society that published that French research has issued a statement saying the study "does not meet the Society's expected standard."

Dr. Kevin Tracey, president and CEO of the Feinstein Institutes for Medical Research in New York City, gave an even more pointed assessment of the French research. "The study was a complete failure," he said.

"It was pathetic," added Art Caplan, head of the division of medical ethics at the New York University School of Medicine.

The study started out with 26 patients taking the hydroxychloroquine, but six were "lost in follow up during the survey because of early cessation of treatment," according to the study.

Three left because they ended up in the intensive care unit, another patient died, and a fifth stopped treatment due to nausea. It turned out the sixth patient didn't actually have coronavirus.

Leaving out the five patients who took the drug and didn't fare well is "cherry picking," said Caplan, the bioethicist."That's not science," he said. "You've got your thumb on the scale.

"The remaining 20 patients took hydroxychloroquine, some with the antibiotic azithromycin and some without, and their outcomes were compared with patients who did not take either drug.

The study authors wrote that "100%" of patients who took the drug combination were "virologically cured" compared to 57.1% of the patients who took hydroxychloroquine alone and 12.5% of the control group. The authors did not fully explain what they meant by "virologically cured."

Caplan added that even without the "cherry picking" issue, a study with such a small number of patients is basically meaningless.

"It's just a jumbled mess," he said.

Several centers are doing clinical trials on hydroxychloroquine to prevent or treat coronavirus, including Harvard, Columbia, New York University and Henry Ford Health System in Detroit.

Tracey, the researcher at the Feinstein Institutes in New York City, is also conducting a study on the drug. He said despite the French study being "seriously flawed," it's still worth looking at hydroxychloroquine to see if it's safe and effective for a subset of coronavirus patients.
Let’s hope trump stops pushing the drug as the end all be all, and finally just let the real medical experts educate the public on it.


But there are still people like DJ who only listen to/worship Trump and the conservative media outlets which parrot everything he says. Damage done.


Guess the mensa geniuses will do the smart thing and wait for medical experts to come to a common conclusion and announce the best treatment(s) - I assume there so many factors involved, including pre-existing conditions of varied patients.

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Reply #142 posted 04/09/20 4:46pm

2elijah

avatar

DiminutiveRocker said:



2elijah said:


benni said:

The journal that originally published an article regarding Chloroquine and Z Pak, have pulled it. This was the same research that Trump used to push it.



Publisher of hydroxychloroquine study touted by Trump says the research didn't meet its standards



https://us.cnn.com/2020/0...index.html



But now the medical society that published that French research has issued a statement saying the study "does not meet the Society's expected standard."


Dr. Kevin Tracey, president and CEO of the Feinstein Institutes for Medical Research in New York City, gave an even more pointed assessment of the French research. "The study was a complete failure," he said.

"It was pathetic," added Art Caplan, head of the division of medical ethics at the New York University School of Medicine.

The study started out with 26 patients taking the hydroxychloroquine, but six were "lost in follow up during the survey because of early cessation of treatment," according to the study.

Three left because they ended up in the intensive care unit, another patient died, and a fifth stopped treatment due to nausea. It turned out the sixth patient didn't actually have coronavirus.

Leaving out the five patients who took the drug and didn't fare well is "cherry picking," said Caplan, the bioethicist."That's not science," he said. "You've got your thumb on the scale.

"The remaining 20 patients took hydroxychloroquine, some with the antibiotic azithromycin and some without, and their outcomes were compared with patients who did not take either drug.

The study authors wrote that "100%" of patients who took the drug combination were "virologically cured" compared to 57.1% of the patients who took hydroxychloroquine alone and 12.5% of the control group. The authors did not fully explain what they meant by "virologically cured."

Caplan added that even without the "cherry picking" issue, a study with such a small number of patients is basically meaningless.

"It's just a jumbled mess," he said.

Several centers are doing clinical trials on hydroxychloroquine to prevent or treat coronavirus, including Harvard, Columbia, New York University and Henry Ford Health System in Detroit.

Tracey, the researcher at the Feinstein Institutes in New York City, is also conducting a study on the drug. He said despite the French study being "seriously flawed," it's still worth looking at hydroxychloroquine to see if it's safe and effective for a subset of coronavirus patients.


Let’s hope trump stops pushing the drug as the end all be all, and finally just let the real medical experts educate the public on it.


But there are still people like DJ who only listen to/worship Trump and the conservative media outlets which parrot everything he says. Damage done.


Guess the mensa geniuses will do the smart thing and wait for medical experts to come to a common conclusion and announce the best treatment(s) - I assume there so many factors involved, including pre-existing conditions of varied patients.




Yes, damage done for the trump followers/defenders. Lol.

I’ll stick with the advice of medical experts/researchers, who actually have experience in the field of medicine.
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Reply #143 posted 04/11/20 1:34pm

13cjk13

avatar

benni said:

The journal that originally published an article regarding Chloroquine and Z Pak, have pulled it. This was the same research that Trump used to push it.


Publisher of hydroxychloroquine study touted by Trump says the research didn't meet its standards


https://us.cnn.com/2020/0...index.html


But now the medical society that published that French research has issued a statement saying the study "does not meet the Society's expected standard."

Dr. Kevin Tracey, president and CEO of the Feinstein Institutes for Medical Research in New York City, gave an even more pointed assessment of the French research. "The study was a complete failure," he said.

"It was pathetic," added Art Caplan, head of the division of medical ethics at the New York University School of Medicine.

The study started out with 26 patients taking the hydroxychloroquine, but six were "lost in follow up during the survey because of early cessation of treatment," according to the study.

Three left because they ended up in the intensive care unit, another patient died, and a fifth stopped treatment due to nausea. It turned out the sixth patient didn't actually have coronavirus.

Leaving out the five patients who took the drug and didn't fare well is "cherry picking," said Caplan, the bioethicist."That's not science," he said. "You've got your thumb on the scale.

"The remaining 20 patients took hydroxychloroquine, some with the antibiotic azithromycin and some without, and their outcomes were compared with patients who did not take either drug.

The study authors wrote that "100%" of patients who took the drug combination were "virologically cured" compared to 57.1% of the patients who took hydroxychloroquine alone and 12.5% of the control group. The authors did not fully explain what they meant by "virologically cured."

Caplan added that even without the "cherry picking" issue, a study with such a small number of patients is basically meaningless.

"It's just a jumbled mess," he said.

Several centers are doing clinical trials on hydroxychloroquine to prevent or treat coronavirus, including Harvard, Columbia, New York University and Henry Ford Health System in Detroit.

Tracey, the researcher at the Feinstein Institutes in New York City, is also conducting a study on the drug. He said despite the French study being "seriously flawed," it's still worth looking at hydroxychloroquine to see if it's safe and effective for a subset of coronavirus patients.

And, it's not just about his "very small personal financial interest " in this snake oil. His cronie gangsters do, though. "Trump “has a personal financial interest” in Sanofi, the French drugmaker that makes Plaquenil, the brand-name version of hydroxychloroquine, The Times reported Monday.

In addition, Sanofi’s largest shareholders include a mutual fund company run by major Republican donor Ken Fisher, the paper said. Trump’s three family trusts, as of last year, each had investments in a mutual fund whose largest holding was Sanofi, according to the Times. Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross also had ties to the drugmaker, The Times reported." Fuck Trump and all the other swamp dwellers he wallows with. LOCK HIM UP.

"hey if you found out someone gave you a fake $20 would you be mad?"
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Reply #144 posted 04/11/20 3:11pm

poppys

13cjk13 said:

benni said:

The journal that originally published an article regarding Chloroquine and Z Pak, have pulled it. This was the same research that Trump used to push it.


Publisher of hydroxychloroquine study touted by Trump says the research didn't meet its standards


https://us.cnn.com/2020/0...index.html


But now the medical society that published that French research has issued a statement saying the study "does not meet the Society's expected standard."

Dr. Kevin Tracey, president and CEO of the Feinstein Institutes for Medical Research in New York City, gave an even more pointed assessment of the French research. "The study was a complete failure," he said.

"It was pathetic," added Art Caplan, head of the division of medical ethics at the New York University School of Medicine.

The study started out with 26 patients taking the hydroxychloroquine, but six were "lost in follow up during the survey because of early cessation of treatment," according to the study.

Three left because they ended up in the intensive care unit, another patient died, and a fifth stopped treatment due to nausea. It turned out the sixth patient didn't actually have coronavirus.

Leaving out the five patients who took the drug and didn't fare well is "cherry picking," said Caplan, the bioethicist."That's not science," he said. "You've got your thumb on the scale.

"The remaining 20 patients took hydroxychloroquine, some with the antibiotic azithromycin and some without, and their outcomes were compared with patients who did not take either drug.

The study authors wrote that "100%" of patients who took the drug combination were "virologically cured" compared to 57.1% of the patients who took hydroxychloroquine alone and 12.5% of the control group. The authors did not fully explain what they meant by "virologically cured."

Caplan added that even without the "cherry picking" issue, a study with such a small number of patients is basically meaningless.

"It's just a jumbled mess," he said.

Several centers are doing clinical trials on hydroxychloroquine to prevent or treat coronavirus, including Harvard, Columbia, New York University and Henry Ford Health System in Detroit.

Tracey, the researcher at the Feinstein Institutes in New York City, is also conducting a study on the drug. He said despite the French study being "seriously flawed," it's still worth looking at hydroxychloroquine to see if it's safe and effective for a subset of coronavirus patients.


And, it's not just about his "very small personal financial interest " in this snake oil. His cronie gangsters do, though. "Trump “has a personal financial interest” in Sanofi, the French drugmaker that makes Plaquenil, the brand-name version of hydroxychloroquine, The Times reported Monday.

In addition, Sanofi’s largest shareholders include a mutual fund company run by major Republican donor Ken Fisher, the paper said. Trump’s three family trusts, as of last year, each had investments in a mutual fund whose largest holding was Sanofi, according to the Times. Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross also had ties to the drugmaker, The Times reported." Fuck Trump and all the other swamp dwellers he wallows with. LOCK HIM UP.


O-H-J-E-S-U-S

"if you can't clap on the one, then don't clap at all"
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Reply #145 posted 04/13/20 9:49am

2elijah

avatar

Definitely more testing needed before these drugs can be proven as safe.

https://www.soundhealthan...e-effects/


Coronavirus Sweden: Chloroquine trials stop due to side effects


“Hospitals in Sweden have stopped using the malaria drug chloroquine on coronavirus patients after reports it was causing blinding headaches and vision loss.

Doctors in the Vastra Gotaland region, 200miles west of Stockholm, are no longer administering the medication, touted as a ‘miracle drug’ by Donald Trump.

A number of patients at hospitals in the county reported suffering cramps, peripheral vision loss and migraines within days of being prescribed the tablets.

For one in 100 people, chloroquine can also cause the heart to beat too fast or slow, which can lead to a fatal heart attack. the medication, touted as a ‘miracle drug’ by Donald Trump.


Chloroquine – which has been prescribed for malaria since the 1940s – had been earmarked as a potential COVID-19 cure after showing promise in studies in China.

Doctors in Europe, the US and China have been given licence to trial the drug on seriously ill coronavirus patients.


But Britain has prevented clinicians from dishing out the drug until clinical trials are completed, citing concerns about its safety and efficacy.

Professor Anthony Gordon – a top critical care doctors in the UK – today said there was still ‘no strong evidence’ the drug could treat coronavirus.
[Edited 4/13/20 9:53am]
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Reply #146 posted 04/13/20 12:30pm

purplethunder3
121

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eek F-U-C-K. I hate to think what serious side effects might occur from new vaccines rushed through the testing process too quick... confused

"Music gives a soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination and life to everything." --Plato
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Reply #147 posted 04/13/20 1:44pm

DiminutiveRock
er

avatar

purplethunder3121 said:

eek F-U-C-K. I hate to think what serious side effects might occur from new vaccines rushed through the testing process too quick... confused


Yeah, as horrible as all of this to endure (the lockdowns, the lack of PPE, the essential workers going at it day after day) no one wants anyone to die from the treatment neutral

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Reply #148 posted 04/14/20 9:01am

benni

avatar

This might be promising for more seriously ill people that are going through a cytokine storm because of this virus. This is different from the chloroquine being used, because the medication is actually used for one of the symptoms that those who get seriously ill from this virus, develop. I'm going to have to keep the name of this medicine with me and if I'm ever admitted to the hospital with this crap, give it to the doctor and tell them if I'm going through a cytokine storm to give me that.

https://www.latimes.com/w...rus-doctor


Soon after being admitted to his own hospital with a fever, cough and difficulty breathing, he was placed on a ventilator. Five days after that, his lungs and kidneys were failing, his heart was in trouble, and doctors figured he had a day or so to live.

Once his colleagues at EvergreenHealth realized they had run out of options, they called Swedish Medical Center, one of two Seattle hospitals that has a machine known as an ECMO, which replaces the functions of the heart and lungs.

But even after the hospital admitted him, doctors there had to figure out why he was so profoundly sick.

Based on the astronomical level of inflammation in his body and reports written by Chinese and Italian physicians who had treated the sickest COVID-19 patients, the doctors came to believe that it was not the disease itself killing him but his own immune system.

It had gone haywire and began to attack itself — a syndrome known as a “cytokine storm.”

The immune system normally uses proteins called cytokines as weapons in fighting a disease. For unknown reasons in some COVID-19 patients, the immune system first fails to respond quickly enough and then floods the body with cytokines, destroying blood vessels and filling the lungs with fluid.

The doctors tried a drug called Actemra, which was designed to treat rheumatoid arthritis but also approved in 2017 to treat cytokine storms in cancer patients.

“Our role was to quiet the storm,” said Dr. Samuel Youssef, a cardiac surgeon. “Dr. Padgett was able to clear the virus” once his immune system was back in balance.

Dr. Matt Hartman, a cardiologist, said that after four days on the immunosuppressive drug, supplemented by high-dose vitamin C and other therapies, the level of oxygen in Padgett’s blood improved dramatically. On March 23, doctors were able to take him off life support.

Four days later, they removed his breathing tube. He slowly came out of his sedated coma, at first imagining that he was in the top floor of the Space Needle converted to a COVID ward.

As Padgett got to know Youssef, Hartman and other team members, they told him about a 33-year-old woman — a mother of three — who was in the hospital as well, also having experienced a cytokine storm. He saw the team’s excitement when they tried the approach on her, and she too recovered.

Padgett went home on April 5. He said Monday that he faced a long, slow recovery, physically and cognitively. He expects to be a better doctor, reminded how devastating an illness can be to a patient and a family.

Trump: "It was hard to get it aroused and it is hard to get it aroused but we got it aroused."
[narrator voice] He's talking about the "American way."
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Reply #149 posted 04/14/20 9:07am

DiminutiveRock
er

avatar

benni said:

This might be promising for more seriously ill people that are going through a cytokine storm because of this virus. This is different from the chloroquine being used, because the medication is actually used for one of the symptoms that those who get seriously ill from this virus, develop. I'm going to have to keep the name of this medicine with me and if I'm ever admitted to the hospital with this crap, give it to the doctor and tell them if I'm going through a cytokine storm to give me that.

https://www.latimes.com/w...rus-doctor


Soon after being admitted to his own hospital with a fever, cough and difficulty breathing, he was placed on a ventilator. Five days after that, his lungs and kidneys were failing, his heart was in trouble, and doctors figured he had a day or so to live.

Once his colleagues at EvergreenHealth realized they had run out of options, they called Swedish Medical Center, one of two Seattle hospitals that has a machine known as an ECMO, which replaces the functions of the heart and lungs.

But even after the hospital admitted him, doctors there had to figure out why he was so profoundly sick.

Based on the astronomical level of inflammation in his body and reports written by Chinese and Italian physicians who had treated the sickest COVID-19 patients, the doctors came to believe that it was not the disease itself killing him but his own immune system.

It had gone haywire and began to attack itself — a syndrome known as a “cytokine storm.”

The immune system normally uses proteins called cytokines as weapons in fighting a disease. For unknown reasons in some COVID-19 patients, the immune system first fails to respond quickly enough and then floods the body with cytokines, destroying blood vessels and filling the lungs with fluid.

The doctors tried a drug called Actemra, which was designed to treat rheumatoid arthritis but also approved in 2017 to treat cytokine storms in cancer patients.

“Our role was to quiet the storm,” said Dr. Samuel Youssef, a cardiac surgeon. “Dr. Padgett was able to clear the virus” once his immune system was back in balance.

Dr. Matt Hartman, a cardiologist, said that after four days on the immunosuppressive drug, supplemented by high-dose vitamin C and other therapies, the level of oxygen in Padgett’s blood improved dramatically. On March 23, doctors were able to take him off life support.

Four days later, they removed his breathing tube. He slowly came out of his sedated coma, at first imagining that he was in the top floor of the Space Needle converted to a COVID ward.

As Padgett got to know Youssef, Hartman and other team members, they told him about a 33-year-old woman — a mother of three — who was in the hospital as well, also having experienced a cytokine storm. He saw the team’s excitement when they tried the approach on her, and she too recovered.

Padgett went home on April 5. He said Monday that he faced a long, slow recovery, physically and cognitively. He expects to be a better doctor, reminded how devastating an illness can be to a patient and a family.



YES! I saw that! Now this is an interesting development!

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